Gen 3 FZ1

scout said:
BUT the second vid showed the R1 cross on the track, and it not only sounded all wrong to my ears, (sounds geeky on the bike) but FELT wrong even through the video.

We've been trained so long on the inline 4 it's gonna take a while to have a 4 that runs like a freakin twin. Even on the vid, the cross didn't have the rush that we're use to on our bike.
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When you're on it, it sounds and feels just right. And it's not like a twin, but it's different. It felt powerful, and as some guy said, deceivingly fast, I was cruising at about 8000 revs, it sounded relaxed, and just right for those conditions, but the speedometer indicated 170~ km/h (about 105 mph) and the cars seemed awfully slow. I was on a 70 km/h limit road. And then you "pull the trigger" and it shoots away, but it's not scary like some R4s with their ketchup effect.
 
javahaxxor said:
I got about 30 min of saddle time. 10min to get out of town, 10 minutes B-roads and back. I didn't say anything about how great it pulls once you go faster because it's been said SO many times before. As always, the truth is in the eye of the beholder. It was MY first impression, and people can go test drive the crossplane R1 and see for themselves if the engine character is right for them.

Why must I be drunk ? because I happen to have another opinion than You ?
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ah no, because you said you were drinking.....(post #55) and what I posted is exactly what it is,, just another opinion...
 
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the gen 3 should be built from scratch..

Just as the 2010 z1000 was.

Heres what i think the gen III should be like..

1.) high performance radial brakes - just like the r1.

2.) more sporty aluminum frame design - the idea is to have the sportiest handling possible.

3.) engine designed from scratch - less bore, more stroke for better low to mid range torque and pull but keep the displacement a 1000.

4.) short gearing for the first three gears for more usability on the road (stronger pull from a standing start), but have 5th and 6th gear really tall for high speed cruising. seriously though first gear is extremely tall on the current gen.

5.) better quality suspension - the current fz1's ride quality deteriorates significantly on bumpy roads.

6.) 190/55 tires standard - for better handling, further establishes that the fz1 is a sportsbike and not a standard.

7.) crossplane crankshaft inline 4 - better traction in corners, unique exhaust sound that gives it strong personality and stands out from all the others, and it just sounds really good (my opinion).

8.) more positive shift feel in the gearbox.

9.) belly pan as standard (my opinion) - aerodynamics and for looks.

10.) lower foot pegs that are adjustable - for the reason people are not all the same size.


But if their was only one thing i could have from this list it would be the crossplane crankshaft engine -_-
 
Razer630 said:
Just as the 2010 z1000 was.

Heres what i think the gen III should be like..

1.) high performance radial brakes - just like the r1.

2.) more sporty aluminum frame design - the idea is to have the sportiest handling possible.

3.) engine designed from scratch - less bore, more stroke for better low to mid range torque and pull but keep the displacement a 1000.

4.) short gearing for the first three gears for more usability on the road (stronger pull from a standing start), but have 5th and 6th gear really tall for high speed cruising. seriously though first gear is extremely tall on the current gen.

5.) better quality suspension - the current fz1's ride quality deteriorates significantly on bumpy roads.

6.) 190/55 tires standard - for better handling, further establishes that the fz1 is a sportsbike and not a standard.

7.) crossplane crankshaft inline 4 - better traction in corners, unique exhaust sound that gives it strong personality and stands out from all the others, and it just sounds really good (my opinion).

8.) more positive shift feel in the gearbox.

9.) belly pan as standard (my opinion) - aerodynamics and for looks.

10.) lower foot pegs that are adjustable - for the reason people are not all the same size.


But if their was only one thing i could have from this list it would be the crossplane crankshaft engine -_-
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Doesn't make sense to have all these features on a naked supersport unless they want to go the ducati or aprilia or superduke way. I would rather convert to a naked R1.
 
CrazyBiker said:
Doesn't make sense to have all these features on a naked supersport unless they want to go the ducati or aprilia or superduke way. I would rather convert to a naked R1.
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I disagree. I think Razor's list is about perfect. I just don't believe they (Yamaha) could do it all for a competitive price vs. the competition. If they could they would send the competition packing.
 
CrazyBiker said:
Doesn't make sense to have all these features on a naked supersport unless they want to go the ducati or aprilia or superduke way. I would rather convert to a naked R1.
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I fully agree, and was just about to say the same, AND that such high performance changes would also drive the prices up - which would be bad. For a naked bike, you don't need brembos, and ohlins, and stuff like that. Let people who really want to pay for the extra goodies modify their bikes, but keep it cheap enough for the mainstream buyer. For instance I don't mind if the rear shock isn't Ohlins grade, since all I do is cruise motorways, B-roads, and wheelies. For the occasional track day I could manage with even less.

Look at what they've done with the FZ8. The fork isn't adjustable, so the motor journalists already say that it's too soft, just like the BMW F800R, and the only way to change that is to change springs in your fork - stuff that'll scare me for instance. I want to have a certain level of adjustment, so the FZ8 would be out of the question for just that reason.

I think the keyword is improvement. Not huge leaps, just small changes. Like for instance the crossplane engine. They have it already, just tweak the crankshaft and inlets, and badabing, you have the new FZ1, which all naked bike enthusiasts will drewl over. Or, lose some weight, that's another improvement which is big enough. Or add an injection map switch like the Multistrada, or Aprilia Shiver. Economy/Mental would be enough.

I've written too much already, so I'll stop.

yes, and shorter gearing in the first three gears, and better shift feel would be nice
 
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Oldschool said:
I disagree. I think Razor's list is about perfect. I just don't believe they (Yamaha) could do it all for a competitive price vs. the competition. If they could they would send the competition packing.
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If they could do it then they WOULD have done it already. They don't want it eating into the R1 sales. Same was the case with Gen1 FZ1 as it seemed like a lightweight tourer. Hence the more sportier FZ1.
 
Aim of the FZ1 is also SuperSport Touring so I would be happy with the crossplane and a better rear shock and bigger tank. Everything else is just dandy!
javahaxxor said:
I fully agree, and was just about to say the same, AND that such high performance changes would also drive the prices up - which would be bad. For a naked bike, you don't need brembos, and ohlins, and stuff like that. Let people who really want to pay for the extra goodies modify their bikes, but keep it cheap enough for the mainstream buyer. For instance I don't mind if the rear shock isn't Ohlins grade, since all I do is cruise motorways, B-roads, and wheelies. For the occasional track day I could manage with even less.

Look at what they've done with the FZ8. The fork isn't adjustable, so the motor journalists already say that it's too soft, just like the BMW F800R, and the only way to change that is to change springs in your fork - stuff that'll scare me for instance. I want to have a certain level of adjustment, so the FZ8 would be out of the question for just that reason.

I think the keyword is improvement. Not huge leaps, just small changes. Like for instance the crossplane engine. They have it already, just tweak the crankshaft and inlets, and badabing, you have the new FZ1, which all naked bike enthusiasts will drewl over. Or, lose some weight, that's another improvement which is big enough. Or add an injection map switch like the Multistrada, or Aprilia Shiver. Economy/Mental would be enough.

I've written too much already, so I'll stop.

yes, and shorter gearing in the first three gears, and better shift feel would be nice
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Gen3

I love the Gen 1. I don't hate the Gen2, nor will I the Gen3. I just really don't think either the two or the 3 is really a replacement for the First Gen. Yamaha have somewhat abandoned one niche to pursue another. If they sell well, then the new niche was a good idea. It doesn't mean that abandoning the Gen1 concept for the Gen2 was a GOOD idea, either. Doesn't mean they wouldn't sell even more if they offered something along the lines of the Gen 1 and also produced the Gen 3 as has been depicted.

I remember sitting on one of the first FZ1s when they were first introduced at the Daytona show. I had never really been a four-cylinder guy, preferring both twins and triples, but having owned a CB750F which was a pretty good bike and absolutely indestructible. So, it was with casual interest that I sat on yet another new bike at another Bike show as had been my habit for more than 30 years. But I wasn't prepared for the absolutely PERFECT fit. My long-time riding buddy, a confirmed BMW sporting rider, shook his head when I told him to sit on it. He sat on it and started shaking his head in another way. A big, "WOW!" was all he could say.

I just can't find that on the Gen 1, although if it had a silver motor instead of a black one I'd have been a bit more taken with it. A bike that ergonomically suited to me (Gen1) makes me a better, faster, more confident rider. For some, that fit and confidence comes from the likes of the R!. Good for them. For some, obviously, it's found on the Gen2. Good for them.

But, in the absence of the Gen1, there is literally no alternative. I had a '98 VFR800 and an '02 Triumph Sprint ST. Both had tolerable ergonomics and a fine chassis and motor, but didn't feel nearly as "old shoe-like" as the gen1. And while I loved the sporting suspension of the VFR, I believe I can ride the Gen1 faster and more confidently than the VFR even if I detuned the Gen 1 to similar engine performance.

Perhaps there are not enough of us to fill a sufficient market for a re-enactment of the Gen1. If so, that's what choice is all about and the market dictates the choices. I don't think we owe Yamaha or any FZ1 our loyalty. My first loyalty comes to myself and my riding needs and wants. There are way to many people out there in consumer lines and at voting booths who have the kind of (in my opinion) misplaced loyalty to cars, motorcycles and politicians just because they once purchased the product. It's a great product because they once believed it.

Please, Yamaha, can we have a new Gen 1 with just a bit better wind protection (abbreviated fairing only, please), maybe some ABS brakes and, of course, we could always use the latest, fastest motor.
 
Wow....10 pages..!!

I guess there will be no purposfull final decree just what an FZ1 is. To me it was... (traded for Roadstar) a nice get anywhere bike. With the Speedbags, it was a tourer. Naked it was a Hotrod, practicality-wise it was cheaper on insurance than an R1. It was big enough to just put gas in and head off anywhere. It was also somewhat uncomfortable for long, long distance riding such as interstate. It was a taste of litre power. We all evolve to different bikes to suit our needs or wants, and sometimes our choice is more experimental as in wanting a fast fast bike. Sometimes its suiitable for a while, other times no....

Sometimes you just get too focused on one bike or car or truck or what-not to see what else is out there, be it different or more extreme than what you have. For instance the practical evolution of a FZ1 for touring would be an FJ touring bike, other times its evolution to a flat out R1., and yet other times a complete different style of bike altogather as in what I'v recently gotten for myself....a Roadstar Silverado. While no Hotrod, it's plenty quick in its Dresser kind of way, and has the tourer thing all wraped up. Comfort is no comparison, and as FZ1 Gen. 1's go, it has way more options for accessories than all the FZ1's combined, though I think thats improving for the FZ's.

This latest prototype is just more of the same, (Gen.1 Gen.2) but I think a bit more honed towards sport.....look at it, Givi stuff would look apples and oranges on it.....My opinion. An 'old mans R1', well an 'old man' might choose another line altogather, as I have, though I will be loyal to the Yamaha line-up, it's just something I see as the right amount of quality, finnish and appeal. I guess it all boils down to what you will be using it for, the length of time you will have it. That used to be most evident in the used bike market with so many having 2-3K miles and then being sold off so as to be able to 'taste' that specific bike, but not get married to it, then taste another, and on and on. I like the looks of this bike, but I wouldn't want it to be my only bike...if that was the case, it would be an all togather different type bike. BUT, There is no do-all be-:2cents::cowboy:all bike out there in my opinion, just alot of temptations.
 
I would love to see Yamaha do what Suzuki did with the B-King. Give us a pure R1 engine NOT detuned with a fairing like it has now, but with a bit of clearance in side if someone wants to add clip-on bars instead...as I did but I couldn't get it to work 100%. Give the FZ1 a FULLY adjustable shock in back, and give the USA the N model option (fully naked). Those things in place, and I would trade my absolutely delightful (now that I've done some moddin') gen 2 FZ1 (2008 model).
Now that's what I would love to see happen. Most of the naked sport bikes are detuned. I hate that. HATE it. Suzuki got it right with the B-King, but kinda got it wrong on some of the styling elements. The Yamaha looks cool. I love mine, especially with a full Yosh system.
 
Im just wondering if Yamaha are going to bring out a Gen3 Fz1.
Why would they make a 800 Fz ? Me thinks that maybe the 800 sits in the middle of 600 and 1000 so they dont have to develop a new model Fz1.
The Japanese have funny ways at times, But I do hope that if there is a new Fz1 its got the Cross plane wank shaft. LOL!!
 
Theres another thing to keep in mind. One of the major reasons Yamaha is NOT going to make a lot of these mods, is I'm sure they dont want FZ1 sales encroaching on R1 sales. After all if they made a Fz1 with full on R1 performance, who would buy an R1? That said, I would buy a full on FZ1:)
 
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