Ivan's ECU Flash

Ivan_IPP said:
Just save the map before you go... I have had many ask me to send it again after they went to have it tweaked.


Ivan
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Have it and your first version on my laptop...no problem! I'll show this last page of the thread to Huey before we get started just so he knows the ins and outs a bit of how the bike is already tuned. More than likely this will probably just be a fun run ($50-$75) rather than a tune that would run $250-275.....I don't feel I really need a "tune" per se. But this is why I'm putting it on there....see what it makes, and how what, if any, other minute changes can/should be made.
 
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Well, here it is. Lower one was the bike with the flash. The top one with about an hour of tuning. Bike runs nice after a good 50+ mile ride right after.

 
Looks good, looks like plenty of fuel was removed down low. Any popping on decel or banging when reapplying the throttle at high revs?

Sent from my Nexus 5
 
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ballmead said:
Looks good, looks like plenty of fuel was removed down low. Any popping on decel or banging when reapplying the throttle at high revs?

Sent from my Nexus 5
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Nope, runs great. I ran the shit out of it after for 50-75 miles after....took the long way home! :D I suspect my mileage will be much better now too. I'm not going to sit here and knock anyone on what's best, etc. etc.... but a custom tune is the way to go once flashed.....my opinion. Bikes are not one size fits all. You could physically see and hear my bike struggle at particular points in the rev range when adjustments were made. Bottom line is that I'm really happy with the bike and the end product.....that's all that matters. I wouldn't change anything I've done along the way. We did hit 148+ on one pull, but we weren't going for peak HP, but ride-ability and smooth fueling.

One thing that was suggested is an unmodified air box. I'll probably get one and try it out on the dyno to see what the results are.

I tried recording it all on my GoPro but it is acting up....not sure if its not liking my data card or what?! Lost all my video from trackday last weekend too. I did have a nice little piece of carbon blow out the exhaust at one point.
 
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Gamecock said:
Nope, runs great. I ran the shit out of it after for 50-75 miles after....took the long way home! :D I suspect my mileage will be much better now too. I'm not going to sit here and knock anyone on what's best, etc. etc.... but a custom tune is the way to go once flashed.....my opinion. Bikes are not one size fits all. You could physically see and hear my bike struggle at particular points in the rev range when adjustments were made. Bottom line is that I'm really happy with the bike and the end product.....that's all that matters. I wouldn't change anything I've done along the way. We did hit 148+ on one pull, but we weren't going for peak HP, but ride-ability and smooth fueling.

One thing that was suggested is an unmodified air box. I'll probably get one and try it out on the dyno to see what the results are.

I tried recording it all on my GoPro but it is acting up....not sure if its not liking my data card or what?! Lost all my video from trackday last weekend too. I did have a nice little piece of carbon blow out the exhaust at one point.
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I had a similar experience when I got mine on the Dyno after the flash. I agree, best thing you can do post flash - get it tuned. I recommend getting all your mods done (pipes, intake etc), before you get the flash, then tune after flash. I've had mine on the Dyno three times, once with just the slip on & air filter, then after the full system, then after the flash. I could have saved a small fortune if I had done all the mods first, then the flash. Live & learn.
 
Dicko said:
I had a similar experience when I got mine on the Dyno after the flash. I agree, best thing you can do post flash - get it tuned. I recommend getting all your mods done (pipes, intake etc), before you get the flash, then tune after flash. I've had mine on the Dyno three times, once with just the slip on & air filter, then after the full system, then after the flash. I could have saved a small fortune if I had done all the mods first, then the flash. Live & learn.
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You and me both, I had it on the dyno again last weekend getting a map done with the stock airbox and very restrictive Arrow dB killer.

Sent from my Nexus 5
 
Gamecock said:
Well, here it is. Lower one was the bike with the flash. The top one with about an hour of tuning. Bike runs nice after a good 50+ mile ride right after.

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Jeff,

There are some things here that do not make sense....

The chart is showing the stock rev-limiter for both runs... this indicates to me that it isn't my flash.
Before you go saying that nobody touched it, I have only one flash file that I use.... everyone else's would have the same problem.

Huey and I cannot stand each other, so it doesn't surprise me that he would give you a chart that shows a 5 hp gain. :)

The bottom line is that you are happy... and this is what matters most, but it's not right to show a 5 hp gain from a 1 AFR change... this is politics at it's worst...
I would never leave 5 hp on the table for anything that I sell. There might be gains of 1 or 2 hp in certain areas and the "before" graph would overlap with the "after" graph in the areas that were improved.

I have nothing else to say here... sorry about that.


Ivan
 
Ivan_IPP said:
Jeff,

There are some things here that do not make sense....

The chart is showing the stock rev-limiter for both runs... this indicates to me that it isn't my flash.
Before you go saying that nobody touched it, I have only one flash file that I use.... everyone else's would have the same problem.

Huey and I cannot stand each other, so it doesn't surprise me that he would give you a chart that shows a 5 hp gain. :)

The bottom line is that you are happy... and this is what matters most, but it's not right to show a 5 hp gain from a 1 AFR change... this is politics at it's worst...
I would never leave 5 hp on the table for anything that I sell. There might be gains of 1 or 2 hp in certain areas and the "before" graph would overlap with the "after" graph in the areas that were improved.

I have nothing else to say here... sorry about that.


Ivan
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That is because he simply entered 12K for the limiter when we started instead of 12.5. I've heard you two have history, but didn't ask details and none were provided other than its there.....and to be honest, I don't really care, its irrelevant. Like I said the bike is sorted out, I have no beef with anyone and I'm not inferring anything. I'm just sharing what I see. I think anyone could benefit from a custom tune. I think its obviously that bikes are not "one size fits all". I wasn't set on max HP numbers at all, drivability for street and occasional trackdays is what I wanted.
 
Hi folks, Huey here.

First (Probably mostly for Ivan):
Ivan, brother I can stand you! All day long. You're the one that was yelling and hung up on me the last time we talked. I still apologized we had to cancel that order but we found the one we had in stock and didn't need it. Sorry to have wasted your time. Still say it's all part of business and you don't have to cuss out 19 year old counter girls over the phone but that's cool. Just because you got all hot doesn't mean I would ever, EVER misrepresent anything to my customer or to anyone else. I have more integrity than that. But seriously, just because I disagree with a lot of things you say doesn't mean I can't stand you. I'm not a child. I can listen to other people's opinions, have or form my own and not feel I have to change theirs or demand mine is the right one. I respect you and yours dude!

Second (for everyone):
I do tune for A/F at first. But then I go looking for power, ride ability and fuel economy. Oh and no decel pop. And yes you can have all those with mapping.

Power is done at the 100% because that's about the only place we care about it. And that's also the only place the bike's max power can be reached and thus why we give customer's graphs showing their 100% runs. You can see on this graph that these two runs were done 44 minutes apart. That's how long it had taken me to tune the entire bike to 13.2 to 1 and then look for max power at the higher TPS's. Always letting the bike cool to 190 before starting the next run.
I don't bounce bikes off the redline with every run and max power had been reached so there was no reason to continue revving out further. What you see is where I rolled off. So no conspiracy theory there.

Also this graph is only for max HP. Don't get me started! I hate "HP". It's so hard to replicate real world. Every dyno reads different, there's different HP, there's different correction factors, etc, etc. That's why I put the tire and tire size in my notes because that has an affect on overall gear ratio and thus calculated HP. A simple tire change can make or cost up to 5 hp on a dyno! But basically HP is torque measured over time. So if you can make some big changes to the map down low (for example like this graph shows) it has a follow on effect all the way through the graph. Thus those changes up to 5,500 rpm can equate to a 5 HP change at 11,500 rpm. Look at it this way. If you rolled the bike up to 10,000 RPM at 20% throttle and then wacked it up to redline the graph wouldn't show 147 HP max. It's not instantaneous it's a roll-on.

Rideability: I put a load on the dyno and just ride it. Pretend coming out of corners, whacking it around 18 wheelers, I'll do a few laps of Talladega GrandPrix in my head. I'll make changes in individual areas or play with the accel- pump feature if it needs changes across the board.

Economy: In 6th gear at steady throttle you end up in a spot on the map that you normally don't ever venture in to. Since it's steady state (think when you start pushing a heavy box across a smooth floor it takes a lot to get it going but once it's sliding you just need to maintain the momentum). So in that area of the map I lean it out to 13.8ish to 1. It's really cool to watch the air/fuel rise when you're just cruising and then as soon as you drop a gear and the RPM's rise or as soon as you whack the throttle to pass a 18 Wheeler the a/f goes back to "mormal"! Beautiful!

So the decel pop: First it's good to understand what's happening. As air puffs out of the exhaust (it's not a steady stream of air) air has to replace it, so fresh air rushes back in from the tail. During decel when the air is a little heavier with unburnt fuel the air coming in hit's the exhaust charge coming out it "can" mix to make the correct ratio for a "bang". You can tune it out in the 0% column on bikes that don't disconnect the fueling on decel. I personally don't like tuning the bike at throttle positions it uses just to make decel popping stop. I'd rather have a correctly running bike and work on making it stop where it actually occurs which is in the tail pipe. Removing the PAIR system usually does away with it. But even then sometimes no matter how happy you make it the temp can change, making the air density different and since your exhaust doesn't have air pressure sensors, temp sensors, fueling maps and etc the "bang" may return. Cost of doing bidness with a straight through exhaust.

Lastly: All bikes are different. And I don't mean different models I mean every single bike. I tell people maps made for every bike are like off the shelf clothing: they say 34x34 but sometimes they fit a little loose, little tight, little long, etc... Custom tailored suit fits PERFECT!
I once had two brothers bring in brand new, identical, freshly uncrated 2007 GSX-R 1000's. We installed K&N's, PC-Vs, Yosh full systems, and TRE's. I dyno'd the first one and saved the map. Uploaded it to the second one and threw it on the dyno. I had to completely retune the second bike! They both ended up making very similar numbers and curves but the mapping was different!

So there you have it. No hidden agendas. No politics. Nothing to hide. No hoo-doo guru. It's not rocket surgery! Just plain ol' hard work.
Thanks for listening. Holler if you have any questions or comments or ideas!
Huey
 
I've been hunting around and can't find instructions on how to remove to old ECU.

I'm about 98% sold on sending my ECU to Ivan for the flash, partly because my FCE went bad last fall. I've ready this whole thread and heard great things about Ivan's product. Even went so far as to call him about the FCE and he recommended the flash over replacing the FCE.

Am I just terrible on searching the forum, or is removing the ECU so simple that it doesn't need documented?
 
Clyde said:
I've been hunting around and can't find instructions on how to remove to old ECU.

I'm about 98% sold on sending my ECU to Ivan for the flash, partly because my FCE went bad last fall. I've ready this whole thread and heard great things about Ivan's product. Even went so far as to call him about the FCE and he recommended the flash over replacing the FCE.

Am I just terrible on searching the forum, or is removing the ECU so simple that it doesn't need documented?
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You lift the tank, remove the airbox cover, remove the velocity stacks then pull out the bottom of the airbox. The ECU is up near the steering stem (Under the air filter hole) and held on place by a rubber band. It takes a little wiggling to get it out and unplugged.
 
Thanks for the quick instructions. Made the job easy! I had to clip a couple of zip-ties in order to get the ECU unplugged, but it wasn't difficult at all.

Shipped it off to Ivan on Tuesday.

I bought the bike "fully Ivanized" from the pre-flash days. I now have an extra Dynojet Ignition Module (and the broken FCE). Plus, the smaller flies are installed, which Ivan said shouldn't make a difference. Once everything is put back together, I'll have to get it on a Dyno to see what the final figures are!

My only "regret" is that it will have been so long since I last rode the bike that I won't have a good before/after feeling. At least doing it this way I'll net zero down-time!
 
Clyde said:
Thanks for the quick instructions. Made the job easy! I had to clip a couple of zip-ties in order to get the ECU unplugged, but it wasn't difficult at all.

Shipped it off to Ivan on Tuesday.

I bought the bike "fully Ivanized" from the pre-flash days. I now have an extra Dynojet Ignition Module (and the broken FCE). Plus, the smaller flies are installed, which Ivan said shouldn't make a difference. Once everything is put back together, I'll have to get it on a Dyno to see what the final figures are!

My only "regret" is that it will have been so long since I last rode the bike that I won't have a good before/after feeling. At least doing it this way I'll net zero down-time!
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Glad to hear this! Well done!

While it has been a long time, I think you will still be amazed at the difference in the bike once you are back on it. It really does become a whole new bike in so many ways.... linear throttle that is responsive and predictable, restrictions in the low gears are gone, smoother running engine, cooler running engine (The initial start/high idle still throws me off). The only pitfall I have had is the decrease in MPG on an already uneconomical bike.... but I really did not buy this for MPG or economy so it doesn't hurt too much... only when I have to be the first one in a group ride to stop for fuel, lol!!!
 
PapaGeno21 said:
Looks like I need to call Ivan tomorrow and see if I can just ride down there and do it on the spot!
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That is what I did and I loved it! It was great getting to pick Ivan's brain while they worked on my bike. He did a few other things to the bike, like sync the throttle etc. Plus the roads where he is are a lot of fun to play with the bike on!

I truly enjoyed doing in in person as I was stationed in Connecticut at the time.... then they moved me to Newport RI :)
 
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