Today I was out riding with my buddies...

DonnieBee

Well-Known Member
...and after lunch I topped off my tank on the center stand of course. It was super hot out (95+). We were headed up the hill, goin hard when suddenly I lost about half my power. It stuttered, went hard again, then repeated the process. One of my buds stayed with me, the other two were off on an after meal food high, so we stopped for a sec, teeing to figure out what it could be. We took aft, hoping it was bad gas, or a clogged jet or so ethnic and would clear itself at high rev. Surprisingly, after running at a consistent speed for a while, it did seem to correct itself. I rode the rest of the afternoon, with no problems. Then, on my way home, same thing, except this time after stopping for a minute, I took off and it tried to die, sputtered, grabbed and if I feathered the throttle it would start running normally again, unless, I got on it hard.

This is what I know. It was definitely brought on under high temp/revs. Then seemed to correct itself as it cooled. My first thought was coils, but I have never heard of coils failing on a gen1. So that leaves fuel right? Bike is fairly low miles (18k), so carbs should be fine.

I got home, dismantled the top and checked all the fuel and air lines. Checked all the wiring for grounds and arcing. Took off the fuel filter and blew it clear. In the end I ended up with the fuel pump in my hand. This is one of those ridiculously expensive Mitsubishi ones, so Im Standing here trying to convince myself I'm wrong. Am I?

Really would appreciate any input you can give. Checked spark by the way, and it's good, but it's cool now and at idle... I took out the air filter and it's dirty but not bad. There is some king of tube that ends inside the air box that seems to be leaking a little fluid that kind of smells like gas. What is that, an overflow filter or something, to keep the gas smell away? Anyway, off topic!

This bike has never had problem one. So I'm left praying it's not the clutch, although this would be the oddest way I have ever seen a clutch go? Only slips at high temp and revs? No, that's impossible now that think about it because of the instant power loss. If the clutch was going it would scream up in revs, right? Gotta be fuel!

What do you think? O mighty forum gods?...
 
Welcome Donnie to the forum. I had the same thing happen to my GenI last year. Same deal, the bike was running great all the way to our destination, about 80 miles away, but on the way home, we topped off the gas, and about 5 miles into our trip home it started sputtering any time I got on the throttle. It eventually died completely. The bike would start up, run a few hundred feet, and then die again.

I was thinking bad gas as well. I wound up leaving the bike on someone's property and waited a couple hours to have someone pick me up and get me home. I went the next day with a van and brought the bike home. It took me almost three weeks to troubleshoot the problem.

Long story short, all the electronics checked out, as well as the fuel pump. I too changed the filter with a new replacement. I finally had to drain the gas tank where I did find water in the gas. I also removed the carbs and cleaned all the jets and passages and reinstalled. After all this the bike would start but never ran correctly. I always felt the power loss.

So here was my scenario after bringing the bike to a shop to have it looked at. It took all of three minutes to find the problem. I filled up the tank with some watered down gas. The water worked it's way into the system. It wound up finally cracking the porcelain on the number three spark plug (which was new by the way), leaving the bike running on three cylinders.

The guy at the shop started the bike and after a minute, checked each exhaust tube starting from left to right. As soon as he felt number three, it was cold to the touch. He shut the bike, replaced the plug, started the bike, problem solved! The bike ran perfectly as before and I haven't had any issues since.

I had checked the spark plugs but although you may see a spark when you test it, what you don't see is that sometimes the spark is arching to the case and not the electrode on the tip, thereby rendering it useless.

I suggest you start the bike and let it run for 5 minutes. Take a spray bottle of water and spray each exhaust tube about 5 inches down from the cylinder head. If the cylinder is firing, the water should immediately boil off the pipe. If it doesn't, thats your bad plug. Also, if that checks out okay, I would consider pulling the carbs and give the jets and bowls a good cleaning. It is possible that one tiny piece of dirt was floating around and finally made it to the jet. It's also possible that it didn't completely lodge itself in the jet and is just floating around in the float bowl explaining why the problem it intermittent.

You know with all the gas additives these days, it only takes a couple of weeks of sitting before stuff starts to gunk up and these carbs are very delicate when it comes to particles of dirt flowing through them.

While your at it, go to any major auto store or Walmart and but yourself a 16oz. can of Seafoam. Run the specified amount (1 Ounce per gallon of gas) through the bike a couple of times. Often thats all it takes to break down any dirt particles. I now use it every 4th or 5th tank of gas. It keeps the bike runnin great.

Hopefully something here will help you out with your problem. I'd hate to see you laid up during the summer without being able to ride. I also know its a pain to have an intermittent problem. Your always afraid to go somewhere far because it might act up. Let us know what you find. Do the water on the pipes first. Good luck!, Billy

P.S. Here is a link to my original thread when I had this same situation. You wouldn't believe how many things I thought it was until it was fixed.
http://www.998cc.org/forum/gen-i-tech/3641-update-my-intermittent-problem.html
 
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I love the Internet!

Billy, thanks bro! In the old days I woulda changed the plugs straight away, but with these hard to get to designs, I find myself avoiding it like the plague.

Where I got gas was right along the Ohio river, in Hannibal Ohio. If anyone is gonna have water in their gas...

I will replace the plugs today. (if I can get em on a Sunday!) I ran carb cleaner all the way home, limping carefully over two hundred miles. As I was getting close, it was nearly stalling with every take off.

:fencers::fencers::fencers::fencers::fencers:

Take that world where you have so spend tons of money to figure out a simple problem!

(hope we are right!)

How does your bike run now? What year is it? Who many miles?
 
Billy, thanks bro! In the old days I woulda changed the plugs straight away, but with these hard to get to designs, I find myself avoiding it like the plague.

Where I got gas was right along the Ohio river, in Hannibal Ohio. If anyone is gonna have water in their gas...

I will replace the plugs today. (if I can get em on a Sunday!) I ran carb cleaner all the way home, limping carefully over two hundred miles. As I was getting close, it was nearly stalling with every take off.

:fencers::fencers::fencers::fencers::fencers:

Take that world where you have so spend tons of money to figure out a simple problem!

(hope we are right!)

How does your bike run now? What year is it? Who many miles?

Just don't jump the gun Donnie. Do the water on the exhaust pipe test first. If the water boils off the pipe right away, then that plug is firing. You don't want to remove and change the plugs if you don't have to. My bike has been running flawlessly since and I just turned over 25,000 miles on it.

I removed the tank from the bike and emptied the gas from it into a clear bottle. On the bottom I noticed the clear film of water. I reported the gas station in question and they said that they would set up an inspection for them. I don't know what happened since I've never heard back from them and I never used that station again. I only use Shell gas now and even though I pay more, I have peace of mind. So try the water test and let me know what you find. Make sure the bike is up to temperature first before spraying the water on the exhaust. The bike is an 01' by the way.
 
Don't worry bro...

... I already emptied the tank, drained the carbs and blew the lines. If this doesn't fix it, then it'll be the fuel pump, (hope not!) or the coils (not likely). Process of elimination. I wouldn't have considered the plugs since it was so sudden, but the contact of water from the jets at such high temp would have been instant! I'm really glad you already have been through this and that you are willing to take the time to share your experience, thereby saving me the same experience! Even if we are wrong, it's really cool. If you're ever in Columbus, Oh, I'll buy you a beer!:flash:
 
... I already emptied the tank, drained the carbs and blew the lines. If this doesn't fix it, then it'll be the fuel pump, (hope not!) or the coils (not likely). Process of elimination. I wouldn't have considered the plugs since it was so sudden, but the contact of water from the jets at such high temp would have been instant! I'm really glad you already have been through this and that you are willing to take the time to share your experience, thereby saving me the same experience! Even if we are wrong, it's really cool. If you're ever in Columbus, Oh, I'll buy you a beer!:flash:

That was my thoughts as well. Me and Tony (NJFZ1) were already over 80 no fault miles into our trip before the bike started acting up. I guess when the water made it through, it immediately cracked the porcelain, making the plug arc jump back onto the case of the plug instead of the electrode.

I doubt very much if your pump is bad. Disconnect the wiring plug, clean the terminals, and put dilectric grease inside of it. This will assure a tight waterproof seal and good connection. Then take a gallon gas can that is full and put the intake line into the can. Use an empty container for the outflow side and turn on the key. The pump will start drawing gas from the can and start filling up the empty container. I thought it was my pump too but it wasn't. Start from the plugs first. Don't waste 3 weeks like I did trying to troubleshoot every thing in sight. Go for the main causes first, Plugs, Bad Gas, Loose Connection, Dirty Carbs, etc.
 
Well, all put back together.

Ran it till it was too hot to want to stand close to. (95 today) all is well so far even at high rpm. All 4cylinders sizzle. Actually seems to run smoother. could be switching to iridium plugs. One note, those plug wires are a bear to seat properly. Anyone notice that before? I noticed that until the rubber cap actually touches the cylinder head snugly, it's not seated. Much drier design than the old yamaha! You'd pull the plug wires and get splashed from all the water pooled obove the plugs. Really not hard to work on this bike once you get inside the head of the designer and start to see how he does things.

Gonna go out and run it hard. Let you know how it goes...
 
Ran it till it was too hot to want to stand close to. (95 today) all is well so far even at high rpm. All 4cylinders sizzle. Actually seems to run smoother. could be switching to iridium plugs. One note, those plug wires are a bear to seat properly. Anyone notice that before? I noticed that until the rubber cap actually touches the cylinder head snugly, it's not seated. Much drier design than the old yamaha! You'd pull the plug wires and get splashed from all the water pooled obove the plugs. Really not hard to work on this bike once you get inside the head of the designer and start to see how he does things.

Gonna go out and run it hard. Let you know how it goes...

Well, since your firing on all four, it may have been bad gas or some dirt in the carbs. I'll be curious to hear your report when you get back. Good luck!
 
Good results!

Just got in. Great ride. Rolling in and out of turns beautifully. Have a question about throttle roll, get back to it in a minute.

All went as planned. Bike is running superbly so far.

Man am I glad I had y'all as a resource! I was falling into that laziness trap we all fall into as we get older. I feel much closer to my FZ now that I have taken her apart. Zen And the art of motorcycle maintenance was a book that guided me as I matured and I had forgotten the principles it taught me. I have been paying people for the last few years to do simple things just because I was "too busy". Admittedly, I did have a lot less time to work on things but after this I will be doing all of my own maintenance and repairs again. It made me remember that I have an invaluable skill that brings me a lot of satisfaction.

I will be watching closely for a while, but I think this time all is well.

As for the throttle question. This bike has always kind of thrown me because of the "hair trigger" nature of the throttle grip. It took a lot of getting used to, but it never did have the precision of other bikes I've owned like my Ducati ST3, or my Triumph Sprint. Is there a fix to make it roll smoother? With more of a "slippery"feel?

Thanks again NY! You're a pretty cool person. Hope I can return the favor!
 
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