Fortunate Ones

Isleoman

Isleoman

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Not trying to bash HD.

Got to reading the HD Pan America forum; I was checking back after seeing new media hype about the newly released 2024 CVO Pan America for $29K. I do like the paint on the 2024. Also intrigued by the ability to lower seat height when stopped.

I had been reading about the myriad of reliability issues with the 20-23 models. Some of these issues are things like motor shutting down at speed, dangerous stuff.

As I was reading I started thinking about our forum for 20 year old bikes and how few problems we truly have. Gotta give Yamaha a lot of credit. I've got close to 350K miles on Gen 1s and never had a major issue, never even been to a dealer with them.

I've jinxed myself now.
 
Isleoman said:
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Not trying to bash HD.

Got to reading the HD Pan America forum; I was checking back after seeing new media hype about the newly released 2024 CVO Pan America for $29K. I do like the paint on the 2024. Also intrigued by the ability to lower seat height when stopped.

I had been reading about the myriad of reliability issues with the 20-23 models. Some of these issues are things like motor shutting down at speed, dangerous stuff.

As I was reading I started thinking about our forum for 20 year old bikes and how few problems we truly have. Gotta give Yamaha a lot of credit. I've got close to 350K miles on Gen 1s and never had a major issue, never even been to a dealer with them.

I've jinxed myself now.
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I call em Hardly Abelsons. Jk. My father in law had one, don't know the model, looked like a low rider. Anyway, that thing the foot pegs vibrated so much I was afraid my feet were going slip off the pegs from the vibes.
 
I'm trying to figure out if the Pan America has more reliability issues than other HD models. Seems to be the case.

I do a lot of informal visual surveys of the bikes I come across. I keep a running total in my head for the first hour or so of my rides, which brings me thru urban and rural areas. In central Mass the HDs make up 80% of what I come across on any given ride.

Point being as a group/brand I admire them for actually getting out and riding. I know at least a half dozen long term HD owners and I haven't heard of the type of poor reliability being reported about the Pan America. Seems like many of the PA's issues are related to the computer control/electronics. I know the original prototype motors were made in Thailand not sure where production motors are made.

In the three years since they introduced the PA I think I've only see one in the wild. Seen a few sitting in front of dealers.

1706370048791.png


I like chubby looking bikes. Even with the bike's lowering feature my wife couldn't have climbed on that passenger seat when she was 16 (hope she don't see this). Looks like it would be a chore for me as well throwing a leg over those boxes with one foot on the ground. That comments would be true for most adv bikes.
 
LOL, i never knew hd made a pa. Wonder how it stacks up against a v-strom power and weight wise. Yeah, we dont need to look up the specs- we already know.
 
I think the specs are very competitive for the ADV bike segment. 95 ft.lbs of torque should be enough for it's intended function.

I can understand why the styling (like the Vrod) might not click with the faithful. I always root for US companies to become competitive (but not through importing). Never had a HD owner kick sand in my face or be disrespectful. In general I have no problem with them over other brand owners.

To paraphrase the political slogan for HD management "It's the reliability, Stupid". The Japanese adopted Dr. Deming's proven statistical quality control after WWII. Americans took the Deming courses in the 90s and said this is hard, lets do something else, like social engineering.







ENGINE

  • Type: Revolution Max 1250 60-degree V-twin
  • Displacement: 1252cc
  • Bore x stroke: 105 x 72.3mm
  • Maximum power: 150 horsepower @ 8750 rpm
  • Maximum torque: 94 ft-lbs @ 6750 rpm
  • Compression ratio: 13.0:1
  • Valvetrain: DOHC w/ variable valve timing; 4vpc
  • Cooling: Liquid
  • Lubrication: Semi-dry sump
  • Transmission: 6-speed
  • Clutch: Wet multiplate w/ assist and slipper functions
  • Primary drive: Gear
  • Final drive: Chain
CHASSIS

  • Frame: Alloy steel stressed-member trellis w/ stamped, cast, and forged junctions
  • Swingarm: One-piece cast aluminum
  • Front suspension; travel: Fully adjustable semi-active Showa inverted 47mm fork; 7.5 inches
  • Rear suspension; travel: Fully adjustable semi-active Showa electronic shock; 7.5 inches
  • Wheels: Tubeless wire-spoke w/ anodized aluminum rims
  • Front wheel: 19 x 3
  • Rear wheel: 17 x 4.5
  • Tires: Michelin Scorcher Adventure
  • Front tire: 120/70 x 19
  • Rear tire: 170/60 x 17
  • Front brakes: 320mm floating discs w/ Brembo 4-piston caliper
  • Rear brake: 280mm disc w/ floating Brembo single-piston caliper
  • ABS: Cornering aware
DIMENSIONS and CAPACITIES

  • Wheelbase: 62.4 inches
  • Rake: 25 degrees
  • Trail: 4.3 inches
  • Seat height: 32.7 – 33.7 inches
  • Ground clearance: 7.1 inches
  • Fuel capacity: 5.6 gallons
  • Estimated fuel consumption: 46 mpg
  • Curb weight: 659 pounds
 
These threads always immediately go off topic to the same topic lol. So, I'll thrown in a view from the otherside:

Harley guy here.
Didn't used to be.
Had an FZ1 before my Lowrider S, regretted trading it in but never, ever, regretted buying that Harley.


The thing that makes Harleys amazing to ride, is the same thing that can cause issues; they're unbalanced. Look at a Harley that's sitting and running, they shake.

The wind hits differently, literally and figuratively because of it.

My bike has over 100lbs of torque at idle , so when I crank the throttle it pulls liked a raped ape. And at 25mph the bike has that "aw yeah" feeling i dont get with the FZ1 till i hit at least 60. I wont win any races, but im smiling the whole time.

It's worth the cost for the right one. Everything is spendy, including light bulbs if you want them to survive that shake. But there is a reason people still fork it over, that character inspires passion, and it's worth a $7 bulb. Lol

Heavy? Yes, its a cruiser, that weight helps a lot in heavy winds. It rides like I'm writing cursive. Different than the FZ1 most certainly, but I wouldn't make the Harley move like the FZ1, I like it moving like cursive just like I like the FZ1 moving sharply. And I should note that Harley feels very rewarding to ride hard through the twisties, the FZ1 just does it. Faster yes... more fun? That's a different question all together.

And I can have that fun at legal speeds.


Maintance wise it's been as reliable as my other FZ1 was, or the SV650 I had (which is considered pretty bulletproof). Ridden through rain, snow, miles of just rocks they called a road.

I know several other riders who have a Harley and a sportbike. Two different things, two different rides. It doesn't have to be one or the other.

Forget about the badge and all you have associated with it, ride several of them, know you can change anything on it if it doesn't quite feel right, and remember it's something different than a sports bike. Think Mustang vs Bronco, two different purposes.

Everything aside; I'm always smiling on the Harley, no other bike has done that for me.
 
Doc Samson said:
I thought Harley's were cool before I actually knew anything about bikes. Don't have anything against them now, but don't really understand the fanaticism of folks for an unreliable, overpriced, slow bike.
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Especially in the 70's. I had the Kawasaki h1 500 and the h2 750 and they, the harley guys called them junk. At least my headlight and gas cap didn't vibrate loose lol. That actually happened to two friends. The pic is me at the tender age of 17
Doc Samson said:
I thought Harley's were cool before I actually knew anything about bikes. Don't have anything against them now, but don't really understand the fanaticism of folks for an unreliable, overpriced, slow bike.
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Doogie2.0 said:
Especially in the 70's. I had the Kawasaki h1 500 and the h2 750 and they, the harley guys called them junk. At least my headlight and gas cap didn't vibrate loose lol. That actually happened to two friends. The pic is me at the tender age of 17
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Classic pic, would make a great poster.
 
Funny you should mention that Isleoman. I had a picture of me riding a wheelie on the h2, I sent the picture off to have a poster made, waited and waited never did get a poster. Never got my picture or my money back. I still have the original for this picture, I could get a poster made.
 
Couple of guys about 7 or 8 years older than me had those when I was a kid. Awesome! I wanted one so bad.

Thank goodness chassis, suspension, brake and tire technology have progressed since then.
 
I didn’t learn about Kawi triples til I was in my 20’s. But I’ll always remember sitting in my moms car when I was 8 and a Z1 did a wheelie up a hill past the 7-11. Pretty sure that was the first time my mind was blown.
 
bunk said:
I didn’t learn about Kawi triples til I was in my 20’s. But I’ll always remember sitting in my moms car when I was 8 and a Z1 did a wheelie up a hill past the 7-11. Pretty sure that was the first time my mind was blown.
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I don't remember my Z1 being that easy to wheelie, certainly not power wheelie. I think they were 85hp. Friends with H2 and bored out Honda 750s could wheelie for miles.
 
bunk said:
MMMMMM, h2 750.....View attachment 28178
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Is that yours? That's nice. Is it an early 72? . I helped a friend build one, it cost him about $10k getting parts off ebay and other places. He contacted the guy that raced for Kawasaki Tony Nicosia, the one that had set the world records back in '69 when the h1 came out. This guy gave him the info to build 120 hp h2 750. When I was a kid I had overhauled mine about 4 times, he had one also and was familiar with them, I'm an electrician i rewired the bike. Here's a Pic of the bike we built. Took about 8 months locating parts and building it. Expand the pic you should be able to see the purple haze heads.
 

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killer5280 said:
Couple of guys about 7 or 8 years older than me had those when I was a kid. Awesome! I wanted one so bad.

Thank goodness chassis, suspension, brake and tire technology have progressed since then.
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There was a couple times i got into a high speed wobble, scary. Then there was this day I was racing my younger brother, he had this gorgeous orange h1 500. I think I was doing a little over 100 moh when my engine started locking up. By the time I pulled the clutch in the back end was starting to slide and I got into one of those high speed wobbles. Scared the hell out of me.
 
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