Drive train play, lag

I have recently purchased a 2002 FZS10 (numbers, according to the insurance form). I am troubled by what is a 60 degree lag (at the clutch) in the drive train. What I am describing is that with the clutch apart and simply the boss and shaft free and the motor in first gear, there is a 60 degree back and forth play at the shaft. I am not sure how this manifests itself in the other gears as I was busy assembling and disassembling. The transmission works great, solid, all six gears, but there is this lag when you let off the throttle and resume. That makes life a little difficult with all the power. I think the previous owner put it through some hard shifting. I have replaced the sprockets and chain and removed the clutch and replaced the basket needle bearing which got rid of the rattling sound it was making. So what is this disconcerting play that does not seem to be the gears themselves but all of them equally? Whoever knows about this let me know.

It is a totally new (for me)driving experience and I want to get all the bugs out.

This is off the subject but when down shifting, it goes into something of a neutral and that is new to me having only driven older bikes and with this I do not get the really engaged down shift. Thanks for any help.
Kent
 
I'm trying to visualise your problem but I can't quite paint a clear picture in my head of what's happening. Are you talking about physical play with the clutch unit when you have the engine case off?

Wish I could help! Maybe a video would be useful! :)
 
Yea the shaft that the clutch rests on has 60 degrees or so of play so when the motor engages it that play must be taken up. Slack is a better word maybe.
I wrote out an explanation to try to be more clear. Sorry I made things too complicated. I will try to simplify. Between the motor out put- primary drive at the clutch and the output at the drive sprocket there is an undue amount of slack. With motor in gear there is 2 inches of slack at the rear wheel (forward and back ward) regardless of which gear. I did a video and the first on this camera and not too much light and I will do a better one if it is not clear. Sorry, I am uncertain of how to get the video viewable..It is an .avi. My technology is not state of the art so It will take some doing. I have alot of things going on right now and its not so easy finding time to learn new things.
Thanks,
Kent
 
Are you saying that with the bike in gear you can move the rear wheel two inches backwards and forwards??

Edit: haha just realised thats a stupid question, in gear the wheel would be spinning . I still dont understand your question :( and with the clutch pulled in it would effectively be in neutral
 
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Sorry, I'm guessing this was not too understandable but I may be on to the solution. To try to reexplain; between the motor when it is turned off and the wheel, with the bike in gear, the wheel can be turned 2 inches or so at the circumference, without turning the motor and that is what is unwanted play or slack. If you have driven a bike with an old primary chain and the chain has stretched somewhat, there is a delay at acceleration and deceleration as the chain must take up the slack and one can feel it. That is sort of what I am referring to.
Having been looking at diagrams of the gearbox and having looked at the clutch, I can not see anything in the gearbox that would be causing me problems and I am wondering if it could be the shock absorbing springs in the clutch which I am not really familiar with.
So I will be thinking about those and if they can be the fault.
Thanks,
Kent
 
Sorry, I'm guessing this was not too understandable but I may be on to the solution. To try to reexplain; between the motor when it is turned off and the wheel, with the bike in gear, the wheel can be turned 2 inches or so at the circumference, without turning the motor and that is what is unwanted play or slack. If you have driven a bike with an old primary chain and the chain has stretched somewhat, there is a delay at acceleration and deceleration as the chain must take up the slack and one can feel it. That is sort of what I am referring to.
Having been looking at diagrams of the gearbox and having looked at the clutch, I can not see anything in the gearbox that would be causing me problems and I am wondering if it could be the shock absorbing springs in the clutch which I am not really familiar with.
So I will be thinking about those and if they can be the fault.
Thanks,
Kent

Hi Kent,

My 2010 Gen II also has around 50-60mm of free play. I think you need to look elsewhere for your issues as mine rides like a dream and I've got 40,000 klms on mine and a new chain and sprockets
 
Hi Kent,

My 2010 Gen II also has around 50-60mm of free play. I think you need to look elsewhere for your issues as mine rides like a dream and I've got 40,000 klms on mine and a new chain and sprockets

Same here, 2010 Gen2 and also have 50-60mm play. I would assume the gen1 would be the same or close to
 
I have been studying and I think that it comes back to the worn out nature of my "slipper clutch" which I have not found much info on. I know some of the springs on it were loose. A "Slipper clutch" was new to me and I will be doing more research and should get things figured out. Thanks to all.
Kent
 
Having reread your original post, have you checked your throttle cable slack? It might be as simple as a loose throttle cable?

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I hate to break the news but when you down-shift and the motor disengages from the rear wheel until you apply the throttle that is a slip clutch or also known as back torque limiter. It is supposed to keep you out of trouble because of the massive amount of possible engine breaking.... Look it up on the Internet.. If you down-shift and the motor is directly connected that is an older or more conventional clutch....Unless your bikes are very different in Australia. My FZ1 2002 certainly has one.
Kent
As far as mechanic that is me.....of course if you want to send me about 1000 us dollars I will take it to another mechanic.:bowdown:
 
I hate to break the news but when you down-shift and the motor disengages from the rear wheel until you apply the throttle that is a slip clutch or also known as back torque limiter. It is supposed to keep you out of trouble because of the massive amount of possible engine breaking.... Look it up on the Internet.. If you down-shift and the motor is directly connected that is an older or more conventional clutch....Unless your bikes are very different in Australia. My FZ1 2002 certainly has one.
Kent
As far as mechanic that is me.....of course if you want to send me about 1000 us dollars I will take it to another mechanic.:bowdown:
I know exactly what a slipper clutch is. You must have an after-market one because the FZ1 doesn't have one stock.
The R1 only started getting them in 2007.

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Ballmead,
Guess you mean when you down shift your motor is still directly engaged? Mine does not, it slips and the first time I got on, it was totally new. It might be that I have a special set up as I had extra luggage racking etc.
Thanks
 
Check the drive cushions inside the rear wheel. You'll need to pull the wheel off, pull off the sprocket to see them. And a word of caution, when you put the whole thing back together, makes sure you torque the nut to the 108 ft pounds that it needs. Don't guess on this little item ( like a friend of mine did and almost lost his life)
But for the most part I think you are seeing nothing wrong. I just checked mine ( 01 FZ1) and I have about the same movement. A delay in accel or decel, could be something else bedsides the drive train. Have you checked to see if your TPS switch is working correctly? Don' t assume the tach will tell you when it goes bad. Pull it off and check the continuity. How about those throttle cables? There are two an accel and a decel. Is the EXUP working OK? Carbs synced, valves adjusted? There are lots of things or a combination of things that can cause accel and decel issues.
 
Sorry I just lost the post I had written. Sorry also asserting I had a slipper clutch. No, I have a standard clutch. My clutch has 6 springs on the back of the basket and 4 are quite loose. I think that is where my malfunction is coming from. The springs are to ease the power transfer. I do not have much time at the moment. I will be rechecking everything. I had changed the sprockets (2) and did find nothing wrong back there. I am not familiar with TPS switch. 108 Lbs is a lot of torque...I closely measured the play presented in the transmission and It is greatest in first and goes down from there with 3&4 and 5&6 being the same so I think that is quite normal. I will be back later on with better news.
Thanks,
Kent
 
Ok, It was the loose springs on the back of the clutch. To make a long story short. I got a used clutch at a good price on ebay and It had the same dilemma with the springs. Following much fussing, etc I have it working properly but it will need a new clutch basket with 6 good springs to work really properly. Sorry about all the confusion. Thanks for the advice...
 
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